Making Mahjong Card Game

[Shirluban]

Also, after shirluban's reply to the malaysian numbered flowers, do you see on my list any cards which actually do the same as the below?

4 x numbered red flowers
4 x numbered blue flowers
4 x numbered green flowers
4 x numbered brown flowers

Yes, these ones do the same:
4 x Seasons
4 x Flowers

For the animals, you don't really need to have so much.
They works by pair, and each pair is used the same way than any other one.
I think maximum 4 pairs are used (8 tiles) at a time.
For their country, I'll better let Tom answer.

PS: Yes, a "pot of gold" is an animal. At least in Mahjong terminology.

[ryulusus]

Hello to all

Ok, for the time being, I'll drop the 16 extra flowers you mentioned, until a revision later.
Fantastic, talking about a revision before the first one is set xD.

Anyway, this is now the version I'll use. Please review for any final changes and then I'll proceed to make a schedule of what is going to be needed and how I'm progressing.


136 BASE CARDS
(4 x 9 Char,
4 x 9 Coins,
4 x 9 Bam,
4 x 4 Winds,
4 x 3 Dragons)

4 x Seasons
4 x Flowers
3 x Japaneses red fives

4 x Vietnamese kings
4 x Vietnamese queens
3 x Vietnamese The General : can be used instead of any suit tile
3 x Vietnamese Dragon Lady : stand for any dragon tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Craks : stand for any wan tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of winds : stand for any wind tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Dots: stand for any pin tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Bams : stand for any sou tile
3 x Vietnamese Big Flower : stand for any flower
3 x Vietnamese The emperor : stand for any tile

4 x malaysian fly
1 x dragon
1 x pearl
1 x little tortoise
1 x big tortoise
1 x bird
1 x cage
1 x cat
1 x rat
1 x cock / rooster
1 x worm
4 x malaysian face (interesting this one, looks like a normal card joker)
1 x fisherman
1 x fish
1 x liu hai
1 x liu hai 3 legged frog
1 x Zhao Gong Ming / Rich Man
1 x pot of gold
1 x chinese 100 uses tile
8 x american / european Joker

Goods

1 x Special Wind / Dealer Marker
1 x Dealer Marker
Lot x Scoring sticks
4 x yakitori
4 x Yakimochi (version of yakitori, same use)
1 x Wareme

Tschuess
Luis

[Barticle]

Can you specify the country they're from?

In his 1976 British booklet 'Discovering Mah-Jong', R.C.Bell explains and illustrates the Cat, Rat, Cock, Worm, Old Man and Bag of Gold in the section on American Mahjong, describing them as a recent (but optional) addition. They could've been imported from another country though.

I'm really not a fan!

[Tom Sloper]

1 x chinese 100 uses tile

No. When a set includes this tile, it always includes four of them. Each one usually has slight variations in design. See examples in FAQ 7e, Mystery Tiles, on my site.

[ryulusus]

Thanks Barticle for that warning.

Ok Tom I'll have a look at the designs.

So after this we have:

136 BASE CARDS
(4 x 9 Char,
4 x 9 Coins,
4 x 9 Bam,
4 x 4 Winds,
4 x 3 Dragons)

4 x Seasons
4 x Flowers
3 x Japaneses red fives

4 x Vietnamese kings
4 x Vietnamese queens
3 x Vietnamese The General : can be used instead of any suit tile
3 x Vietnamese Dragon Lady : stand for any dragon tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Craks : stand for any wan tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of winds : stand for any wind tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Dots: stand for any pin tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Bams : stand for any sou tile
3 x Vietnamese Big Flower : stand for any flower
3 x Vietnamese The emperor : stand for any tile

4 x malaysian fly
1 x dragon
1 x pearl
1 x little tortoise
1 x big tortoise
1 x bird
1 x cage
1 x cat
1 x rat
1 x cock / rooster
1 x worm
4 x malaysian face (interesting this one, looks like a normal card joker)
1 x fisherman
1 x fish
1 x liu hai
1 x liu hai 3 legged frog
1 x Zhao Gong Ming / Rich Man
1 x pot of gold
4 x chinese 100 uses tile
8 x american / european Joker

Goods

1 x Special Wind / Dealer Marker
1 x Dealer Marker
Lot x Scoring sticks
4 x yakitori
4 x Yakimochi (version of yakitori, same use)
1 x Wareme

[Tom Sloper]

Can you specify the country they're from?

In his 1976 British booklet 'Discovering Mah-Jong', R.C.Bell explains and illustrates the Cat, Rat, Cock, Worm, Old Man and Bag of Gold in the section on American Mahjong, describing them as a recent (but optional) addition. They could've been imported from another country though.

When he says "American" mahjong, he's talking about British mahjong as some Americans play it. He's not talking about National Mah Jongg League mahjong, which is the most prevalent American variant.
The animal flowers probably originated in Singapore or Malaysia. See http://www.sloperama.com/mahjongg/malaysian.htm

[ryulusus]

The animal flowers probably originated in Singapore or Malaysia

Hmmmm in that case I'll choose Singapore, since in the list there are no references to it,
and I want to be broad on the influences (since I am sure that there were many in tile creation,
and there are already some Malaysia and Vietnam)

Current:

4 x 9 Char,
4 x 9 Coins,
4 x 9 Bam,
4 x 4 Winds,
4 x 3 Dragons

4 x Seasons
4 x Flowers

3 x Japaneses red fives
4 x Vietnamese kings
4 x Vietnamese queens
3 x Vietnamese The General : can be used instead of any suit tile
3 x Vietnamese Dragon Lady : stand for any dragon tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Craks : stand for any wan tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of winds : stand for any wind tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Dots: stand for any pin tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Bams : stand for any sou tile
3 x Vietnamese Big Flower : stand for any flower
3 x Vietnamese The emperor : stand for any tile

4 x malaysian fly
1 x singapore dragon
1 x singapore pearl
1 x singapore little tortoise
1 x singapore big tortoise
1 x singapore bird
1 x singapore cage
1 x singapore cat
1 x singapore rat
1 x singapore cock / rooster
1 x singapore worm
4 x malaysian face (interesting this one, looks like a normal card joker)
1 x singapore fisherman
1 x singapore fish
1 x liu hai
1 x liu hai 3 legged frog
1 x Zhao Gong Ming / Rich Man
1 x pot of gold
4 x chinese 100 uses tile
8 x american / european Joker

Goods

1 x Special Wind / Dealer Marker
1 x Dealer Marker
Lot x Scoring sticks
4 x yakitori
4 x Yakimochi (version of yakitori, same use)
1 x Wareme
1 x card hand holder origami

Any more change suggestions?

Cheers
Luis

[Tom Sloper]

The animal flowers probably originated in Singapore or Malaysia

Hmmmm in that case I'll choose Singapore, since in the list there are no references to it...
1 x singapore dragon
1 x singapore pearl
1 x singapore little tortoise
1 x singapore big tortoise
1 x singapore bird
1 x singapore cage
1 x singapore cat
1 x singapore rat
1 x singapore cock / rooster
1 x singapore worm
4 x malaysian face (interesting this one, looks like a normal card joker)
1 x singapore fisherman
1 x singapore fish
1 x liu hai
1 x liu hai 3 legged frog
1 x Zhao Gong Ming / Rich Man
1 x pot of gold

I think it looks very silly to add "Singapore" to the names of animal flowers. I don't think you need to do that. Especially since there is no certainty that that's where their inclusion did originate.
You didn't add "Singapore" to all the animal flowers. Liu Hai and Zhao Gong Ming and their matched flowers are also animal flowers, so should be treated the same way as the others. I never saw or heard of these big turtle, little turtle tiles, but last night I noticed that in one of my sets there are two more animal flowers: a monkey paired with something round, not sure what it is, on a branch. Either a fruit or a nut. Are you sure your set needs to include every conceivable variation on an animal flower?
BTW, you said "since in the list there are no references to it"? On the Malaysian mahjong website it clearly says:
4.......Faces (or extra Flower)
4.......Animals (or extra Flower) **<--- SEE
4.......Fly (or Joker)

[Barticle]

The more "animals" you include, the harder it will be to keep track of them all before and during play. Would suggest you use some sort of colour-coding or lettering to show which ones constitute pairs (so for example you'd match the two with a blue border or the two marked F).

I still think you need more red fives. A standard Japanese set would have four (and some would have more).

http://www.jantaku.net/file/20/dsc01680.jpg
http://www.sasaki-mj.com/images/product/P09030070.JPG

You could even think about including red threes and red sevens too...!

http://preview.tinyurl.com/red3and7

[ryulusus]

You didn't add "Singapore" to all the animal flowers. Liu Hai and Zhao Gong Ming and their matched flowers are also animal flowers, so should be treated the same way as the others. I never saw or heard of these big turtle, little turtle tiles, but last night I noticed that in one of my sets there are two more animal flowers: a monkey paired with something round, not sure what it is, on a branch. Either a fruit or a nut. Are you sure your set needs to include every conceivable variation on an animal flower?

Very well, deleted and stopped with the "animal flowers" adding.

BTW, you said "since in the list there are no references to it"? On the Malaysian mahjong website it clearly says:
4.......Faces (or extra Flower)
4.......Animals (or extra Flower) **<--- SEE
4.......Fly (or Joker)

Not a problem, will leave them as is now and stop.

I still think you need more red fives. A standard Japanese set would have four (and some would have more).

Actually I'll let it be 9 (3x3) since each page of the PDF will have a 3x3 card grid.
I believe these 8 red fives were placed to fill up the necessary space on the pack.

So this is updated version:

4 x 9 Char,
4 x 9 Coins,
4 x 9 Bam,
4 x 4 Winds,
4 x 3 Dragons

4 x Seasons
4 x Flowers

9 x Japaneses red fives (3 x 5 bam / 3 x 5 char / 3 x 5 Coin)
4 x Vietnamese kings
4 x Vietnamese queens
3 x Vietnamese The General : can be used instead of any suit tile
3 x Vietnamese Dragon Lady : stand for any dragon tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Craks : stand for any wan tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of winds : stand for any wind tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Dots: stand for any pin tile
3 x Vietnamese Lord of Bams : stand for any sou tile
3 x Vietnamese Big Flower : stand for any flower
3 x Vietnamese The emperor : stand for any tile

4 x malaysian fly
1 x dragon
1 x pearl
1 x bird
1 x cage
1 x cat
1 x rat
1 x cock / rooster
1 x worm
4 x face (interesting this one, looks like a normal card joker)
1 x fisherman
1 x fish
1 x liu hai
1 x liu hai 3 legged frog
1 x Zhao Gong Ming / Rich Man
1 x pot of gold
4 x chinese 100 uses tile
8 x american / european Joker

Goods

1 x Special Wind / Dealer Marker
1 x Dealer Marker
Lot x Scoring sticks
4 x yakitori
4 x Yakimochi (version of yakitori, same use)
1 x Wareme
1 x card hand holder origami

More comments?

Cheers
Luis

[Barticle]

Actually I'll let it be 9 (3x3) since each page of the PDF will have a 3x3 card grid.
I believe these 8 red fives were placed to fill up the necessary space on the pack.

That's why there's normally four, yeah, or eight in those cases.

I don't like the imbalance between suits though so nine is ideal!

What's with the origami thing...?

[Tom Sloper]

4 x 3 Dragons
Cheers
Luis

Only 4x3 dragons? Which type? Chung, fa, bai I assume -- no American-style dragons (with pictures of dragons)?

(^_^) Just giving you a hard time. But that's a quandary I had to figure out when I was playing around with the same "universal tile set" thing you're doing.

[ryulusus]

What's with the origami thing...?

When I bought the mini mahjong card set game from RM shop, it come with some extras,
one of them being a type of folding paper which resulted in a card holder,
a stripe of paper in which you could place the cards, even on the table;
imagine a RESERVED sign on a table of a restaurant, and then it's cut a bit on the lower side,
where the cards can be housed and played with. I want to find an origami which does such a thing,
since after finding an x-Wing origami, I'm sure somebody already made one up

Only 4x3 dragons? Which type? Chung, fa, bai I assume -- no American-style dragons (with pictures of dragons)? (^_^) Just giving you a hard time. But that's a quandary I had to figure out when I was playing around with the same "universal tile set" thing you're doing.

Actually I have no idea what you're talking about Tom ^_^ Do you mean Americans just made up new honors? Is that it?

By the way Tom, Shirluban, perhaps you could come to definite answer as to if the animal flowers little and big tortoise do exist or not, since Shir stated they are a 164 malaysian deck standard and Tom just said that he had never heard that one before. Can you please tell me if it does or not?

Cheers

[Tom Sloper]

Only 4x3 dragons? Which type? Chung, fa, bai I assume -- no American-style dragons (with pictures of dragons)?

Actually I have no idea what you're talking about Tom ^_^ Do you mean Americans just made up new honors?

Go to FAQ 7e on my website. Watch the animated red, green, white dragons -- every known type is in there (including the dragon/phoenix alternative to chung/fa). http://sloperama.com/mjfaq/special.htm

[Barticle]

I want to find an origami which does such a thing,

I see!

Are you going to start designing the cards soon?

since after finding an x-Wing origami,

Oh really? Cool!

This reminds me... As a self-confessed geek and sci-fi fan, I'm a little ashamed to say that it took me over a year to spot the connection between Japanese mahjong and Star Wars. (The call-sign of Luke's X-Wing was "Red Five"!)

Off-topic but not worth its own thread - I saw my first "four kongs" abortive draw while playing online earlier this evening. I declared the fourth kong which killed a hand with a lot of dora that would've been painful for someone (probably me since two of my opponents already had guaranteed yaku (open yakuhai) and the fourth revealed a tenpai hand with a three-sided wait). Phew!