Game-ending Draw

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imagelesskink
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Game-ending Draw

Post by imagelesskink » Thu May 22, 2014 2:03 am

When I was playing at Anime Central in Chicago, I called riichi while in furiten to force a ryuukyoku. It was the last hand, and since the dealer wasn't in tenpai, the game ended just like that and the riichi stick didn't go to anyone. Is this what was supposed to happen? Should the game have continued despite the dealer being no-ten or should the riichi stick have gone back to me?

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Ignatius
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Re: Game-ending Draw

Post by Ignatius » Thu May 22, 2014 2:57 am

As far as I know, the Riichi stick (Riichi-bô), when a game ends with a draw in the last hand of the game, goes to the player with most points.

I would like to confirm this, hearing other people´s opinion about this subject.
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or2az
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Re: Game-ending Draw

Post by or2az » Thu May 22, 2014 4:53 am

What I know about this subject comes from Barticles Guide. He may chose to weigh in for a more detailed explanation, but for now, the guide states as follows (p.27):

"If there are still Riichi stakes on the table at the end of a game (i.e. if the final hand of play
results in a draw without a dealer continuance) then they are claimed by the overall winner.
Riichibō Modoshi (lit. "Riichi stick returning") is an optional rule whereby any Riichi stakes left
on the table after a match will instead be returned to the people that played them".

edit: It seems there is a third option; no one gets them.
Last edited by or2az on Mon May 26, 2014 11:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Game-ending Draw

Post by Senechal » Thu May 22, 2014 7:01 am

It depends on local rules. Usually, as mentioned previously, any spare riichi sticks go to the winner. This seems to be standard in club play and cash games.

There are the occasional exceptions to the rule. The upcoming WRC in Puteaux (Paris area), France will not return riichi sticks to the winner and simply delete them from existence.

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Re: Game-ending Draw

Post by imagelesskink » Thu May 22, 2014 7:49 am

The stick didn't go to anyone. I was 600 points behind, so if it came back to me I would have taken first.

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Re: Game-ending Draw

Post by Shirluban » Thu May 22, 2014 9:34 am

AFAIK, there are three options:
• Go to the table winner, despite he didn't win the hand.
• Go back to the riichi declarer, despite he lose his bet.
• Go to oblivion: you've bet, you lose, nobody wins, so nobody gets it.
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Re: Game-ending Draw

Post by Iapetus » Thu May 22, 2014 2:30 pm

We need to go deeper.

The stick goes to the winner, but what if there is a tie for 1st?

In most Japanese rulesets, any ties are broken with Kamichadori (dealer order preference). So the stick goes to whoever wins the tiebreaker. In EMA and WRC rules, however, there can be a tie. Uma is split, but how about the riichi stick? Well, in WRC it never goes to anybody - a rule chosen to avoid what happens with EMA rules. Indeed, if 2 players tie for 1st, the stick is split and both get 500 points. And if three players are tied for 1st, they all get 333.333... points. Try explaining that to a tournament organiser, or the ranking manager!

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Scott Miller
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Re: Game-ending Draw

Post by Scott Miller » Mon May 26, 2014 8:36 pm

JPML leaves any unclaimed riichi sticks on the table at the end of the last hand. No one gets them. EMA gives them to the match-winner.

Did they announce the ruleset they were playing?
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Re: Game-ending Draw

Post by Ozball » Tue May 27, 2014 10:43 pm

I think the NPM also leaves the sticks on the table, and the local store based tournament I was in did the same. So it looks like for Japanese tournaments they leave them on the table, but for casual play it goes to the person with the highest score (broken by dealer preference if there is a tie)
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