Today's WWYD

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Tom Sloper
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Today's WWYD

Post by Tom Sloper » Wed Jul 13, 2011 3:58 pm

Today's WWYD is on the ReachMahjong front page, but in case you don't feel like going there, here it is:
Image
Clearly I've been shooting for tanyao to this point, but to throw 9S is to choose between either the red 5S or dora, when it's possible to get both, so I'd be inclined to throw 1P at this point (deferring that decision until later).
But the hand doesn't look promising. Too many loose ends in the hand, and the first row of discards is almost used up.
4649おねがいします。

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Re: Today's WWYD

Post by WaveMaster » Wed Jul 13, 2011 4:38 pm

I would definitely toss the 1P at this point.

The person to your right has only cut simples in dots and characters so far, which could indicate any number of potentially dangerous hands but makes me lean towards a half-flush with potential for full-flush in bamboo. His hand may not be coming together quickly, but if you cut either the 5B or 9B it seems likely to me that it would get called, which would increase his momentum.

I think it's early enough that this hand still has a decent chance of coming together, so I wouldn't want to gimp myself by dropping the 9B and then drawing the 8B later.

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Re: Today's WWYD

Post by Iapetus » Sat Jul 16, 2011 1:21 am

I'd get rid of the 68m kanchan. Waits on 3 tiles and the improvement 5m also completes the 34m ryanmen. The two ryanmen and the dora-either-way ryankan are definite keeps. The hand lacks a solid pair, and the 12234p shape is ideal for getting one. 1245p turn the pins into pair+shuntsu+ryanmen, with 5 actually making a three-way-wait. The 12 is also a penchan waiting on 3p - 3 of which are left, so the wait's actually practically equal to the 68m kanchan, which pales in comparison to everything else in the hand. And of the kanchan, it's better to discard the 8-crak because the 6 can still be used for a 3456, which may end up somewhat useful.

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Re: Today's WWYD

Post by xKime » Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:41 am

2-dot

From the tile efficiency point of view, leaving enough shapes (taatsu) to make groups (mentsu) while preserving a 1-4p nobetan shape which may be useful later.
From the te-yaku point of view, I'd rather aim for ittsuu if possible, sanshoku is kinda far away.
From the player point of view, don't want to discard any of 'em souzu tiles to the guy to our right, especially when it's the dora suit and all.

Also, it's important not to push so hard in this hand as well, as it's not likely to be a winning hand with this shape at this point. Rather, I'd try to see if I can make it build some menzen strength or fold it if it doesn't come together. That's why there's no point in just dealing every 1 and 9 in your hand praying for a tan yao or pinfu tenpai just to fall magically into your hands, but rather aim for some yaku while maintaining a good shape.

As an example of this line of thinking, a natural discard order could be:

3-crak 4-crak 6-crak 8-crak 5-bam 7-bam 9-bam 1-dot 2-dot 3-dot 4-dot 6-dot 7-dot
draw: 6-bam discard 9-bam (or draw 8-bam and discard 5-bam )

(You'll have to picture the 5s as red)

3-crak 4-crak 6-crak 8-crak 5-bam 6-bam 7-bam 1-dot 2-dot 3-dot 4-dot 6-dot 7-dot
draw 6-crak discard 8-crak (or viceversa)

3-crak 4-crak 6-crak 6-crak 5-bam 6-bam 7-bam 1-dot 2-dot 3-dot 4-dot 6-dot 7-dot

(or similar)

The shape becoming considerably better. One away from tenpai and also you can take the one away from ittsuu (full straight) at the time you draw something in the pinzu area.

On the other hand, keeping that 1-dot 2-dot 2-dot 3-dot 4-dot will bring tougher and more delicate decisions quite a few times, but it will end up making you tray too hard for this hand which is otherwise not worth of it. Especially once you draw 3-dot as you won't be able to go for tan yao anyway and you'll most likely have to reach to get a yaku.

Discarding the 1-dot to fixate on tan yao in the first place is not bad, but it would kinda imply you have to discard 9-bam and you get an overlapped 2do uke (redundant wait?) for 2-5p. If you plan on calling tiles to win the hand fast and with effort, it's okay to discard 1-dot and go for tan yao, but I don't think the hand is worth of it. At least until you have another dora in it.
Also, another disadvantage of fixating on tan yao is that if you call from the 57s shape, you'll be in a problem when you draw the dora. That, and the shape is still relatively bad.

For such reasons, and probably a few others, my choice is 2-dot and then see what happens.

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Re: Today's WWYD

Post by zzo38 » Sat Aug 13, 2011 5:06 am

I would probably try to make tanyao by throwing 1pin, and then 9sou unless I need to change (in which case you can make dora more likely but then possibly lose 1 yaku). After that, 2pin can be discarded (unless you make 2pin the end pair, which can also do since you complete 34 with 2 or 5 which can be red) you might also have pinfu unless you need to call other tiles to make chii (or pon, but probably chii in this case) (but calling chii is a more difficult decision than pon anyways for a few reasons, but at least you have more time since it is your turn anyways). It might be difficult to win but it seems early to me, to figure that out.

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Re: Today's WWYD

Post by Referee » Sat Aug 13, 2011 7:35 pm

I'm no expert, so take this with salt to taste. I would discard 8-crak now, if you draw 3-dot you may be able to replace your tanyao with iipeikou (or even get both) later.

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