About the front-page article by Gemma.
Well, if you look at the Olympics, for instance, there are basically three \"official languages\" of the Olympics. English, French, and the native language of whatever country it\'s being held in.
So if Reach Mahjong enters the mainstream, tournaments would probably be something like English, Japanese, and the native language.
Linguistics of Mahjong
Moderator: Shirluban
Re:Linguistics of Mahjong
Thanks for the comment!
Yeah I suspect you\'re right. The World Series had three languages, Japanese, Mandarin and English. Interestingly, I don\'t think Cantonese was one of the official languages but I may be wrong...
I used to be a strong supporter of the opinion that mahjong should be taught in the native language of the beginner so as not to put them off getting into the game. (Especially the people that I used to teach who had no grounding in East Asian cultures and were very nervous that the game would be too complicated for them.)
However, now I\'m really seeing the benefit of learning the Japanese alongside as it would give us all a universal platform to work from.
At least we all use Arabic numerals! Otherwise that would be a real nightmare. ;)
Yeah I suspect you\'re right. The World Series had three languages, Japanese, Mandarin and English. Interestingly, I don\'t think Cantonese was one of the official languages but I may be wrong...
I used to be a strong supporter of the opinion that mahjong should be taught in the native language of the beginner so as not to put them off getting into the game. (Especially the people that I used to teach who had no grounding in East Asian cultures and were very nervous that the game would be too complicated for them.)
However, now I\'m really seeing the benefit of learning the Japanese alongside as it would give us all a universal platform to work from.
At least we all use Arabic numerals! Otherwise that would be a real nightmare. ;)
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hirohurl
- Senior Reacher
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Re:Linguistics of Mahjong
What we (the foreign players in our 3-player-mj group in Hiroshima) tend to do is use Japanese terms for yaku (tanyo, pinfu) and for actions or events (pon, kan, riichi, ron, tsumo etc), winds, dragons and the dora bonus, but use English for the numbers and suit tiles (coins, bamboo, characters).
Re:Linguistics of Mahjong
Not on the tiles we don\'t.gemma wrote:At least we all use Arabic numerals! Otherwise that would be a real nightmare. ;)
Re:Linguistics of Mahjong
From personal experience:
- When teaching beginners, the tiles should have Western-style indices. This is because mahjong is just a game, not a necessary life skill, and the person you are trying to teach is likely to get discouraged if you throw too much at them too soon. Also, if you just want to get a game going, the characters are a considerable hurdle.
- The only Japanese you really need to bother with is the calls.
Analogy:
Suppose this is medieval Europe and you are trying to teach a merchant the newfangled Arabic numerals. Do you think you are going to refer to 1, 2, 3, as wahid, ithnayn, thalatha, or as one, two, three?
- When teaching beginners, the tiles should have Western-style indices. This is because mahjong is just a game, not a necessary life skill, and the person you are trying to teach is likely to get discouraged if you throw too much at them too soon. Also, if you just want to get a game going, the characters are a considerable hurdle.
- The only Japanese you really need to bother with is the calls.
Analogy:
Suppose this is medieval Europe and you are trying to teach a merchant the newfangled Arabic numerals. Do you think you are going to refer to 1, 2, 3, as wahid, ithnayn, thalatha, or as one, two, three?
Re:Linguistics of Mahjong
I don\'t think there\'s a problem using arabic numerals, but I just think the tiles look better without them. Although, there are beginners who need them for the wan tiles in particular.
Re:Linguistics of Mahjong
One of the ways I\'m easing my friends into learning the Chinese characters is to play the 3p variant without the 2-8 of characters. That way, they only have 8 character tiles to worry about (1 & 9 characters, 4 winds, 2 dragons). The red dragon doesn\'t really count either since it\'s red. The green one, unfortunately, is black in my set.
The winds are easy to look up in a reference sheet I made them.
The winds are easy to look up in a reference sheet I made them.
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hirohurl
- Senior Reacher
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- Location: Hiroshima, Japan
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Re:Linguistics of Mahjong
Hi Pekepan,
I agree, in the end we are only talking about learning to RECOGNIZE a few characters here, not the whole 1,945 Joyo Kanji list!
1-9 Coins and 1-9 Bamboo are self-explanatory (OK, so the 1-Bamboo needs to be explained).
White Dragon likewise.
Red Dragon is easy to remember...
The \"Green\" Dragon and 4 winds need a little bit of effort and a crib sheet for beginners.
That leave the 1-9 of characters, but as it is only the numbers at the top that you really need to concentrate on, you can learn 1-3 in a few seconds, so that leaves 4-9, or six tile patterns to add to the crib sheet...
In short, you only need to try and remember 11 different characters, and even with today\'s dumbed down \"education\" system, most elementary school kids could do that with a little bit of effort in a morning... I hope.
Hey it\'s hot and humid here in Hiroshima, so if my post sounds grouchy tonight, please bear that in mind!
David H
I agree, in the end we are only talking about learning to RECOGNIZE a few characters here, not the whole 1,945 Joyo Kanji list!
1-9 Coins and 1-9 Bamboo are self-explanatory (OK, so the 1-Bamboo needs to be explained).
White Dragon likewise.
Red Dragon is easy to remember...
The \"Green\" Dragon and 4 winds need a little bit of effort and a crib sheet for beginners.
That leave the 1-9 of characters, but as it is only the numbers at the top that you really need to concentrate on, you can learn 1-3 in a few seconds, so that leaves 4-9, or six tile patterns to add to the crib sheet...
In short, you only need to try and remember 11 different characters, and even with today\'s dumbed down \"education\" system, most elementary school kids could do that with a little bit of effort in a morning... I hope.
Hey it\'s hot and humid here in Hiroshima, so if my post sounds grouchy tonight, please bear that in mind!
David H
Re:Linguistics of Mahjong
I remember when I started playing mahjong, it was Taiwan style and when I taught my friends, I made cheat sheets for the number suits and the directions (however some friends insisted that an upside-down :east was a \'happy dinosaur\' with arms wide open :S
Anyways, they would say pon and chow, and everything went well until I left for Japan and came back trying to teach them Reach style. The hardest part is getting them to learn the hands themselves, let alone telling them the japanese names of them.
I am hoping Jenn\'s book will help! *I have yet to teach any of my friends Reach, let alone keep their attention span...*
Anyways, they would say pon and chow, and everything went well until I left for Japan and came back trying to teach them Reach style. The hardest part is getting them to learn the hands themselves, let alone telling them the japanese names of them.
I am hoping Jenn\'s book will help! *I have yet to teach any of my friends Reach, let alone keep their attention span...*