Question about Renho and Chiho

[WorTeX]

First to quote EMA rules:
CHIHO Winning on self-draw in the very first un-interrupted go-around.

RENHO Winning on a discard in the very first un-interrupted go-around.

Does chiho apply to south only, or to every players first draw?

Can you score renho while being east, from a discard of north? or does it only apply to easts first discard?

[Shirluban]

Does chiho apply to south only, or to every players first draw?

Chiho applies to every player during the first go-around. I mean it applies for south, west and north (east winning on his first draw will score tenho).

Can you score renho while being east, from a discard of north? or does it only apply to easts first discard?

Renho applies to everyone during the first go-around.

EMA said "A player’s turn begins when a tile is acquired and ends when a tile is discarded. During a go-around all players have their turn once."
So the first go-around lasts when east draw a tile.

East, south, west and north can score renho by winning with east, south, west and north discards.

[b4k4ni04]

As Renho applies to having a complete hand finished by a discard. It makes sense that South, West, and North could Renhou from East. West and North could Renhou from South. And North could Renhou from West.

(Barring calls of Kan, Pon, or Chi, which interrupt go-arounds and eliminate the chance for Chiho or Renho.)

http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E4%BA%BA%E5%92%8C
From JPN wiki on Renhou: (ko ga haipai de tenpai shita jyoutai de, saisho no tsumo yori mae ni suterareta hai de ron <win> shita sai ni seiritsu suru)

Translated == This is the case for Renho: If a non-dealer is in tenpai with their initial hand, and they win by ron from a discarded tile before their first draw.


This supports my assumption in my first paragraph. After your first draw, you are no longer eligible for Renhou. Better hope you draw your own win for Chiho. This all assumes you have a hand in tenpai.

And if you dont, oh well, at least you can double reach :D?

[WorTeX]

If I understand correctly, the info given by b4k4ni04, EMA rules are in conflict with a source I would call reliable, and make much more sense. Thank you.

Just asking because I\'m making some sort of improvement plan-list and these things are exactly what I\'m after, better explained situations and such, currently EMA RCR-rulebook has few nice loopholes like this text WHICH IS NOT TAKEN OUT OF CONTEXT: \"After the end of a hand, it is determined whether East stays East or whether the privilege
proceeds to the next player. East stays East if he declares mahjong or is tenpai.\" I really like staying east while in tenpai even when someone other wins ;)

[b4k4ni04]

Hmn. So EMA doesn\'t clarify that it has to be before your first draw, eh? Also, your loophole is horrible XD.

Example: You: deal into someone\'s hand.
They: celebrate that you\'re not dealer anymore.
You: show your hand as tenpai.
Them: D: :(

haha yeaaaaah <<;. that needs fixing.

[Shirluban]

After your first draw, you are no longer eligible for Renhou.

Yes, after your first draw you don\'t have you initial hand, so you can\'t claim renhou.

I missed that :side:

[Ignatius]

I´ve read the japanese wikipedia and it says that Tenho is done with the first 14 tiles obtained when dealing, so there´s no option to do it with your first draw.

Chiho Is done for all players except the East. You must be in Tempai with your first 13 dealed tiles and win with your first tile obtained from the wall.

And Renho is the same as Chiho but won with Ron. Is allowed for No East players.

Why in the European Riichi rules don´t say that clearly?

[mostek]

is a yaku required for a rencho?
with chiho you will automatically get the menzen tsumo yaku, but supposing you have a hand that is in tenpai but lacking a yaku, can you still win with renho?

[Shirluban]

is a yaku required for a rencho?
with chiho you will automatically get the menzen tsumo yaku, but supposing you have a hand that is in tenpai but lacking a yaku, can you still win with renho?

Renho IS a yaku.
Tenho and Chiho are also yaku.

[mostek]

is a yaku required for a rencho?
with chiho you will automatically get the menzen tsumo yaku, but supposing you have a hand that is in tenpai but lacking a yaku, can you still win with renho?

Renho IS a yaku.
Tenho and Chiho are also yaku.

right that makes sense.. so i feel stupid now lol

althought now I guess If i ever get such a lucky hand I can win without worrying about a chombo so thanks